listen to democrats on their own candidates' qualifications to be president!/obarma and religion - an interview | politics news at abelard.org
abelard's home latest changes & additions at abelard.org link to document abstracts link to short briefings documents quotations at abelard.org, with source document where relevant click for abelard's child education zone economics and money zone at abelard.org - government swindles and how to transfer money on the net latest news headlines at abelard's news and comment zone
socialism, sociology, supporting documents described Loud music and hearing damage Architectural wonders and joys at abelard.org about abelard and abelard.org visit abelard's gallery Energy - beyond fossil fuels France zone at abelard.org - another France

news and comment
politics

article archives at abelard's news and comment zone topic archives: politics

for previously archived news article pages, visit the news archive page (click on the button above)

New translation, the Magna Carta

site map
'Y

This page helpful?
Share it ! Like it !
    


listen to democrats on their own candidates’ qualifications to be president!

Only 17% of Clinton supporters ‘think’ Obama is very qualified to be president,
while only 41% of Obama supporters ‘think’ Hillary is very qualified.

In fact, 43% of Clinton supporters say Obama is not very qualified at all. [See paragraphs 9 and 10]


“3. I’m going to read you a list of candidates. If the Texas Democratic presidential primary were held today, would you vote for Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama?

“1. Hillary Clinton 45%
“2. Barack Obama 48%

“9. Regardless of which candidate you support, how qualified do you think Hillary Clinton is to be president of the United States?

  - Qualified - - Not qualified -
  Vry Smwht Ntvry Not
Clinton supporters 79% 16% 1% 2%

“10. Same question for Obarma supporters

Obama supporters 72% 23% 2% 2%

As this may be read by Demogogacrats, let me explain.

Even among Hillary supporters, only 79% think she is very qualified
and among Obama supporters, only 72% think he is well qualified.

This means more Obama supporters do not have much confidence (correctly of course) that Obama is fit to lead.

That is, over one-fifth of Hillary supporters do not think she is very ready to lead, and nearly three-tenths of Obama supporters do not think he is very ready to lead .


Also revealing, on being asked the following question:

“8. I’m going to read you a list of qualities many people think are important in presidential candidates. Thinking specifically about your vote in the primary, which ONE quality mattered most in deciding who you are supporting over the other candidate in the Democratic primary...”

only 15% answered:

“Has the best chance to win against the Republican”

Quite incredible. Only a dogmatist could prefer their own prejudices to whether ‘their’ candidate can win the presidency (given they have no serious problem with a candidate).

related material
who is obama?

the web address for the article above is
https://www.abelard.org/news/politics0802.php#democrat_innumeracy_290208





advertising
disclaimer


advertising
disclaimer


advertising
disclaimer




obarma and religion - an interview [11 pages]
An interview from 16 October, 2006

Attend to the fact that, as usual, Obama tells you little of what he does believe.

“I was not raised in a religious household. My maternal grandparents, who hailed from Kansas, had been steeped in Baptist and Methodist teachings as children, but religious faith never really took root in their hearts. My mother's own experiences as a bookish, sensitive child growing up in small towns in Kansas, Oklahoma and Texas only reinforced this inherited skepticism. Her memories of the Christians who populated her youth were not fond ones. Occasionally, for my benefit, she would recall the sanctimonious preachers who would dismiss three-quarters of the world's people as ignorant heathens doomed to spend the afterlife in eternal damnation--and who in the same breath would insist that the earth and the heavens had been created in seven days, all geologic and astrophysical evidence to the contrary. She remembered the respectable church ladies who were always so quick to shun those unable to meet their standards of propriety, even as they desperately concealed their own dirty little secrets; the church fathers who uttered racial epithets and chiseled their workers out of any nickel that they could." [Quoted from time.com, p.3]

“It was because of these newfound understandings--that religious commitment did not require me to suspend critical thinking, disengage from the battle for economic and social justice, or otherwise retreat from the world that I knew and loved--that I was finally able to walk down the aisle of Trinity United Church of Christ one day and be baptized. It came about as a choice and not an epiphany; the questions I had did not magically disappear. But kneeling beneath that cross on the South Side of Chicago, I felt God's spirit beckoning me. I submitted myself to His will, and dedicated myself to discovering His truth.”

“Already disadvantaged by a late start and a lack of funds, Mr. Keyes had, during the course of a mere three months, managed to offend just about everybody. In that sense, he was an ideal opponent; all I had to do was keep my mouth shut and start planning my swearing-in ceremony [...]” [Quoted from time.com, p.6]

“[...] We need to take faith seriously not simply to block the religious right but to engage all persons of faith in the larger project of American renewal.” [Quoted from time.com, p.8]

Note the cynical intent by Obama to use religion to his objectives. This is reminiscent of the socialist ‘the end justifies the means’.

related material
who is obama?

the web address for the article above is
https://www.abelard.org/news/politics0802.php#obama_religion_interview_290208

on iran, then and now

  • well, here’s a change! a writer who is not talking nonsense about iran

    “ It is a doctoral dissertation submitted to Harvard University more than 50 years ago by a young scholar named Henry A Kissinger. In his thesis, published later under the title A World Restored, Kissinger explained how the Iran of its day - revolutionary France - was drawn into a new security architecture by the status-quo powers of Europe.

    “The hero of Kissinger's tale was the Austrian chancellor, Prince Metternich, who drew the great powers toward the Congress that kept the peace for nearly a century.”

    “It may be that American-Iranian dialogue would reveal the impossibility of achieving a modern-day version of the Congress of Vienna. That would be unfortunate, for all the parties. History tells us that if Iran continues to act as a revolutionary power, and seeks to project and expand its power, then a future war of containment may be inevitable. But that course would be folly on Iran's part - as unwise as Napoleon's march into Russia.”

  • iran remains evasive re nuclear weapons - un’s iaea

    “The UN's nuclear watchdog says it cannot provide "credible assurances" that Iran is not building a bomb despite new data supplied by Tehran.

    “The International Atomic Energy Agency said Iran had granted new site access but remained evasive on key issues.”

the web address for the article above is
https://www.abelard.org/news/politics0802.php#bellicose_iran_280208

why is obama not presidential material - why is obama so confused

“On pain of his own integrity”
“Become more and more invisible [....] you become a shape-shifter.”
Shelby Steele on Barack Obama

Now if only it were Shelby Steele running for election.

“Shelby Steele is a senior fellow at the Hoover Institution whose research examines the role of race in American society and the consequences of contemporary social programs on race relations.”

There is a 5-part interview, based on his book, A Bound Man: Why We Are Excited About Obama and Why He Can't Win, accessible from this page. There are other useful book summaries available from the page.

Part 1 part 2 part 3 part 4 part 5

This is the one book of analysis on Obama I thought I may have to read. Maybe this interview will save me the task. Recommended viewing.

Marker at abelard.org

This is the one book of analysis on Obarma I thought I may have to read. Maybe this interview will save me the task.

Marker at abelard.org

A Swahili name, Barack has its origins in Arabic. The Arabic root of the name, B-R-K, means ‘blessed’. In Arabic, this root is used in many other phrases to indicate blessings and people who are blessed:

  • Mabruk! = Congratulations!
  • Barakallah feek = May god bless you
  • Barakah = blessings from god (this also the feminine version of this name)

Why then is it provocative/unfair blah blah etc to use his Hussein name, but not unacceptable to use his Barack name?

His names were clearly given by his Muslim father.

Added data: for a good part of his life, Obama has been addressed ‘Barry’.

Marker at abelard.org

Written by an alleged, long-term associate of Obarma’s daddy:

“Barack Obama Junior's grassroots activities among the oppressed of Chicago's South Side show that he is keenly aware of his people's suffering and needs. They prove that he has not gone over to the white man's world.”

“This was perhaps why marrying a white woman didn't bother Barack Senior. And there is much to be said for that woman's own mental and moral courage that she was willing to join a black man whose world was as far away as the moon and in a country where such a marriage could prove opprobrious.

“There was, however, another white woman. That was why, when I first heard of Obama Junior [Barack], I assumed that he was Ruth's son. Ruth was the wife I knew after Obama Senior came back from America and worked for Tom Mboya in the Ministry of Economic Planning.

“After Obama Senior had left Anne in Honolulu, he studied at Harvard, where he met and befriended Ruth. She afterwards followed him all the way to Home Squared. I assumed that Junior was either David or Mark, Ruth's two sons whose names I no longer remembered.

“What I remember, however - and much of it emerges from Obama Junior's book - was that Obama Senior's marriage to Ruth was not a happy one. Like his father, although charming, generous and extraordinarily clever, Obama Senior was also imperious, cruel and given to boasting about his brain and his wealth.

“It was this kind of boasting that proved his undoing in the Kenyatta system - although, as he said, there was tribalism in it - and left him without a job, plunged him into prolonged poverty and dangerously wounded his ego.

“Like me, he was excessively fond of Scotch. In his later years, he had fallen into the habit of going home drunk every night. This was what forced Ruth to sue for a divorce to marry another friend of mine, a Tanzanian.

Scotch, indeed, was what proved to be Obama Senior's final undoing. Driving a car always excited him excessively.

“Obama Senior had had many extremely serious accidents. In time, both his legs had to be amputated and replaced with iron. But his pride was such that he could not tolerate "crawling like an insect" on the road. I was not surprised when I learned how he had finally died [in a car crash]."

I have not yet seen this about “many accidents” in other sources.

Obama Senior also has children by other women.

Marker at abelard.org

“ A fellow columnist for Political Gateway, Andy Martin, has a different take on Barack Obama. He says Barack Obama has not only invented large parts of his political resume, he also says the story about his father being a "goat herder" is not true. He claims Obama has become the "man behind the mask," hiding his real family history and his father's religion.”

“He says he has conducted an investigation which has gathered information from three continents, and Obama’s father was in fact never a lowly "goat herder". He claims his father was a child of privilege and affluence. His research, which I have now confirmed, indicates the Obama family was a prominent Muslim family in Kenya.

“Barack Obama’s father, it turns out, was never a lowly "immigrant". Instead, like other children of privilege, he was a person with access to the highest levels of government in Kenya and as a result of those connections, was able to come to America to study. Keep in mind it was 1958. African or even Arab students in America were a rarity, not the rule as they are today. How likely would it have been for a "goat herder" to be able to get to America to go to, of all places, Harvard?" [Quoted from mlrmag.com]

This is clear, in that several of Daddy Obama’s children have been educated in the West. But while granddad was not among the worst off, neither am I yet convinced that he was ‘rich’.

Marker at abelard.org

Why Condoleezza Rice left the Democrat Party:

“Two events made Condoleezza Rice switch from being a registered Democrat to a Republican.

“The first was when she watched the 1984 Democratic National Convention that nominated Walter Mondale for president. Rice, who grew up during segregation, was turned off by an endless refrain of appeals to “women, minorities, and the poor, which basically means helpless people and the poor,” she has said. Rice decided she would “rather be ignored than patronized.”

“The second event was Jimmy Carter’s professed shock at the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan, demonstrating naivete and spotlighting his feeble approach to national security. The spectacle sickened her.

“Substitute the name Barack Obama for Walter Mondale and Jimmy Carter and you have a good summation of this presidential candidate’s approach.”

related material
who is obama?

the web address for the article above is
https://www.abelard.org/news/politics0802.php#obama_data_270208

brown the clown attempts to be statesman-like on immigration and citizenship

Quotes taken from a speech made by UK prime minister Gordon Brown the Clown on citizenship.

“So the surest foundation upon which we can advance socially, culturally and economically in this century is to be far more explicit about the ties - indeed the shared values - that make us more than a collection of people but a country.

“This is not jingoism, but practical, rational and purposeful - and therefore, I would argue, an essentially British form of patriotism. Patriotism is the sense that 'all-of-us' matters more than 'any-of- us'.”

Yes, Gordon Brown is a socialist. The individual doesn’t matter, only the herd.

“It defines a nation not by race or ethnicity, but by seeing us all as part of a collective project from which we all gain and to which we all contribute.”

Yes, the collective....

“Society is - as the great thinkers have long told us - a contract, even a covenant, in which we recognise that our destinies are interlinked.”

Yes, we are “interlinked”....

There is no such thing as the individual.

“For rights ....”

What “rights”? Where is the real Bill of Rights?

“... only exist where people recognise responsibilities; responsibilities only exist where people have a sense of shared fate; ...”

“Fate”? Is he a muslim?

“... and shared fate only exists where there is a strong sense of collective belonging.”

Again, the collective...

“So Britain is not just where we are but in an important sense part of who we are.”

We are the nation, we are the country, we are we...

Again, there is no individual.

Long live the herd.....
Long live the fatherland...
Long live the socialist heerenvolk...
Long live the 1000 year ‘new’ labour ant hill.

the web address for the article above is
https://www.abelard.org/news/politics0802.php#statesman_clown_270208

the sleazy clown and his ‘new’ labour wasters - the secretive, spendthrift, socialist state

“Then there was the revelation that the Government had spent £800 million over five years on trying to reduce the rate at which students drop out of university, to no effect whatever: the drop-out rate stayed exactly the same.”

“ If, as a concerned citizen, you want to find out how quangos spend the £123 billion they are handed by the Government (that's more than the budget for the NHS and defence combined), you may find yourself up against state-funded lawyers using every legal trick in the book to oppose your request.”

“The Government has created 200 new agencies in the past two years. In the decade since Labour came to power, spending on quangos has increased from £24 billion to more than £123 billion. If you are wondering what you get for the extra £100 billion, wonder on.

“The Government won't tell you - and it couldn't even if it wanted to. Because the truth is that you get almost nothing extra.”

the web address for the article above is
https://www.abelard.org/news/politics0802.php#spendthrift_nulabour_260208

at last, hillary confronts obarma

“the sky will open, the light willl come down....”

related material
who is obama?

the web address for the article above is
https://www.abelard.org/news/politics0802.php#hillary_250208

“my experiences at princeton have made me far more aware of my blackness than ever before” - missis obama

This item has been incorporated into michelle obama despises america - and why it matters

the web address for the article above is
https://www.abelard.org/news/politics0802.php#missus_obama_240208

why is the media hiding obama’s alleged gay fling and coke use?

“Presidential candidate A is accused of having a risky homosexual dalliance with someone he picks up in a bar, scoring powdered cocaine for his partner and crack cocaine for himself in an incident that allegedly occurred about nine years ago. The named alleged partner makes his charges public, agrees to a polygraph and files a lawsuit reiterating the charges and accusing the candidate of harassment and intimidation. The candidate refuses to deny the allegations.

“Presidential candidate B is accused by unnamed sources of having a romantic interest in a female lobbyist in the same year. There are no specific allegations of sexual or drug-related incidents. Both the candidate and the lobbyist adamantly deny any untoward activity between them took place.

“Yet, for the Big Media, there is no story involving presidential candidate A, but a raging mega-story involving candidate B.”

The story...

The video...

The accuser has also gone to court with his allegations, claiming intimidation.
Copies of the lawsuit documents
1 2 3

The accuser agrees to take polygraph test

“Larry Sinclair $100,000 Polygraph challenge has been scheduled for next Tuesday in New York City. 2/18/2008 1:00 PM

“We're not ready to share all the details about our upcoming evening lie-detecting with Obama accuser Larry Sinclair, but there are a few things that we want to tell you - namely that we've agreed on a time and place to carry out our wager with Mr. Sinclair.

“We're going to meet him on Tuesday, February 26th at an undisclosed location in New York City. We've picked a polygraph expert, too: a renowned expert who has been involved in quite a few high-profile cases who we're not going to name until the results are not only in, but have been verified by a second renowned expert.

“Then, we'll post the results, the names of both polygraph experts, and other relevant information, along with video and pictures, here on Whitehouse.com. Since the outcome of the test will be vital interest to the voting public, our findings will be made available before the presidential primaries in Texas and Ohio slated for March 4. That's all for now, but check back for updates.”

The above source seems to have offered $10,000 up-front just for taking the test.

Note, so-called ‘lie detection’ is junk science. For more see ‘lie detection’.

related material
who is obama?

 

the web address for the article above is
https://www.abelard.org/news/politics0802.php#obama_fling_210208

yet another vain socialist depleting a society - venezuela

“At the same time, PDVSA's investment spending has been slashed, leading to a decline in oil output, the motor of the economy, for ten consecutive quarters, according to José Guerra, a former Central Bank director. A much-trumpeted government plan to increase oil production to 5m b/d by 2012 does not seem to have got off the ground. Officials claim that daily production is holding steady at over 3m barrels, but other sources (including OPEC) put the figure at less than 2.5m, and falling. Venezuelans use more oil themselves, thanks to a consumer boom and Mr Chávez's reluctance to raise the price of petrol. Officially, consumption is 600,000 b/d; it may be a third higher, reckons Ramón Espinaza, a former chief economist for PDVSA. Meanwhile, Mr Chávez is shipping 300,000 b/d to Caribbean neighbours (notably Cuba) at subsidised prices.

“No important new deposits have been found since the president took office in 1999. Officials admit that PDVSA is short of drilling rigs for exploration (though Mr Chávez recently loaned two rigs to Ecuador). Much therefore hangs on the development of the Orinoco belt, with its estimated 250 billion barrels of heavy crude. But many of the companies recently invited (without competitive tender) to take part in these projects are state-owned outfits from countries, such as Iran and Belarus, whose governments are friends with Mr Chávez; most lack both the expertise and the financial muscle to develop them.”

the web address for the article above is
https://www.abelard.org/news/politics0802.php#venezuela_socialist_210208

turning around the economy - 4 years of socialism in spain and an election in 3 weeks

“After a remarkable 14 consecutive years of growth, the Spanish economy is showing signs of fatigue.

“Having long outpaced France, Germany and Britain, Spain's GDP growth will fall below the EU average by the end of 2009, according to the European Commission.

“At 4.4%, inflation is at a 10-year high, while January's unemployment figures were the highest for eight years.

“With a decade-long housing boom also spluttering to a halt, the opposition is suddenly keener to talk economics, rather than Eta.”

the web address for the article above is
https://www.abelard.org/news/politics0802.php#spanish_economy_200208

kaletsky views the clown’s incompetence with due deserved contempt

“All in all, what Mr Darling announced yesterday was a financial and political disaster of almost unimaginable proportions. The Northern Rock saga did not end yesterday; the fiasco has only just started, with the Government now officially in charge.”

related material
sunday afternoon - panic in nu-labour treasury chicken coop

the web address for the article above is
https://www.abelard.org/news/politics0802.php#kaletsy_on_nr_190208

sunday afternoon - panic in nu-labour treasury chicken coop

Some context: The UK Treasury Minister announces, before announcing to Parliament, that the Northern Rock mortgage bank will be nationalised - that is, wholly owned by the UK tax payers. Recall that the UK government has already bailed out Northern Crock by guaranteeing between £50-100 billion to prevent a company, now dubiously valued at maybe £400 million, from collapsing.

Keep an eye on the outrageous lie that, by this action, Nu-Labour is protecting the tax payer’s interests. The lie is that this bank is sound.

If the bank was sound, buyers would be lining up around the block.

This is going to be yet another huge destruction of money and value by the Socialist Clown, Gordon Brown.

The only reason the government is doing this is political, and they are hoping to bury the losses (and doubtless, increasing the losses).

The losses will be buried by spinning things out slowly, and trying to bury the loss numbers in their usual cooked books.

As previously stated, this is government theft, as well as misuse of taxes.

“Darling has three options. To nationalise the bank, to back a rescue by a consortium led by Sir Richard Branson’s Virgin and, third, to pick a revised restructuring proposal put forward on Friday evening by the existing management.

“The first option, where there is still a 50:50 chance, would leave the government facing years of litigation from angry Rock investors. The legal case would be championed by two hedge funds, SRM and RAB Capital. These funds, which have a fiduciary duty to protect their own investors, have invested about £150m for a 20% stake. The paper value of that stake is now some £80m and they will not go down without a fight." [Quoted from business.timesonline.co.uk]


only socialists like darling and the clown could believe it

I’m not going to sell my old banger until someone offers me a good price. I’ll just have to wait until the market improves.

It’s the fault of the market that no-one wants to buy this pile of rusting dreck.

I’ll get my money back when the market improves.

I bought the car for £100 billion, which I’d stolen from taxpayers.

I’ve had several offers for the rust-bucket from scrap metal dealers, but I’m convinced it will become a collector’s item if I keep it a while and paint it white.

It was on the market for £12 billion a year back, but the best I’ve been offered so far is £400 million. But even after I’ve painted it, I still can’t get more than £400 million, even with the £120 billion housing deeds being claimed is in the boot.

Tell you what - there’s this clown in No. 10 who is just dithering for offers. He says he’ll take anything that will look good to the taxpaying sheep.

He might even be able to flog the Crock for £500 million, ’cos then at least he can pretend he got a good deal.

Don’t worry, I’m going to pay the taxpayers back and even make a profit for them.

When ... the ... market ... improves J

related material
on money - northern crock
bubbles, debt, borrowing and inflation in the uk

the web address for the article above is
https://www.abelard.org/news/politics0802.php#nationalise_nr_170208

al quaeda under pressure - pelosi-obama iraq defeat strategy is failing

“Al-Qaeda in Iraq faces an "extraordinary crisis". Last year's mass defection of ordinary Sunnis from al-Qaeda to the US military "created panic, fear and the unwillingness to fight". The terrorist group's security structure suffered "total collapse".

“These are the words not of al-Qaeda's enemies but of one of its own leaders in Anbar province - once the group's stronghold. They were set down last summer in a 39-page letter seized during a US raid on an al-Qaeda base near Samarra in November.”

“ "There were almost 600 fighters in our sector before the tribes changed course 360 degrees . . . Many of our fighters quit and some of them joined the deserters . . . As a result of that the number of fighters dropped down to 20 or less." ”

related material
attack allies, appease enemies, abandon friends- obama and his ‘tough’ foreign ‘policy’

the web address for the article above is
https://www.abelard.org/news/politics0802.php#iraq_success_110208

who is obama?

Why is the fossil media silent?

This news item has been incorporated into a new page: Who is Barack Obama?

the web address for the article above is
https://www.abelard.org/news/politics0802.php#obama_040208

“i would vote for the devil over john mccain” - ann coulter - the auroran sunset

Watch this right-wing extremist foam on Fox TV - hilarious! [Runs for just under 6 minutes]

the web address for the article above is
https://www.abelard.org/news/politics0802.php#coulter_mccain_030208

useful article on hitler’s politics, by kershaw

“ "Circumstances have forced me to almost only speak of peace for decades. It was only through the continued emphasis on the German desire for peace and peaceful intentions that it was possible to give the German people the arms that were always a requirement for the next step." [Hitler, Nov. 1938]

“Nevertheless, the affective integration which Hitler's mounting popularity during the first years of the dictatorship undoubtedly created was of immeasurable importance. Whether the adulation of Hitler was genuine or contrived (as it doubtless was in many cases), it had the same function. Millions of Germans who might otherwise have been opposed to, doubtful about, or only marginally committed to the regime and Nazi doctrine were publicly seen to give Hitler their backing. This was crucial to the dynamic of Nazi rule.”

related material
the psychology and development of Adolph Hitler Schicklgruber - abelard
Did Hitler know about the holocaust? A psychological assessment

Heads up from dvd.

the web address for the article above is
https://www.abelard.org/news/politics0802.php#hitlers_politics_020208

spectacular in baghdad after obama and hillary’s encouragement of weakness

“Early reports put the death toll from both attacks at more than 50. The bombings were carried out by women suicide attackers wearing explosive vests, witnesses said.”

For those that say the attack happened too soon after the Democrat presidential candidate debate in California that took place the evening before the attack, when do you suppose the attack were planned?

Buying a gun is for a purpose. When and where it is fired is a second decision for the purchaser.

Do not under-estimate this enemy. They have irrational objectives, but they pursue them enthusiastically, and purposefully.

The objective of the jihadi bombers is simple - break the will of the Western governments and their electorates. Why were the Madrid bombings timed to coincide with elections?

Americans can expect increased efforts the nearer the Presidental election approaches.

Here are the words of Barack Obama last night....

“[...] We both have said that we need to have a strike force that can take out potential terrorist bases that get set up in Iraq”

It is a fundamental and naive error to suppose that the jihadis do not look to manipulating the politics of the Coalition. Their prime objective is to co-opt the lazy-minded and foolish fellow travellers in the West.

The jihadis know full well that the greatest possible victory to which they can aspire is to recruit Hillary Clinton or, even better, Obama.

The first ambition of the jihad is weak American ‘leadership’. That is precisely what the Democrats are offering and represent.

the web address for the article above is
https://www.abelard.org/news/politics0802.php#baghdad_attack_010208


You are here: politics news from February 2008 < News < Home

latest abstracts briefings information   hearing damage memory France zone

email abelard email email_abelard [at] abelard.org

© abelard, 2008, 1 february
all rights reserved

variable words
prints as increasing A4 pages (on my printer and set-up)